AI Rebels
The AI Rebels Podcast is dedicated to exploring and documenting the grassroots of the current AI revolution. Every week a new episode is posted wherein the hosts interview entrepreneurs and developers working on the cutting edge. Tune in to benefit from their insight.
AI Rebels
AI Rebels ft. Robert Scoble
In this episode of the AI Rebels podcast, tech pioneer Robert Scoble shares his journey through the AI landscape, from early consumer apps to current advancements. With a focus on innovation, Scoble provides a forward-looking perspective on the future of AI technology. Don't miss this engaging conversation!
hi everybody and welcome to another episode of the AI Rebels podcast we're very excited to have Robert Scoble here with us today I'm sure many of our listeners are familiar with Robert and all that he's done over the past several years we're excited to kind of get your take on the AI space Robert thanks for joining us I've been doing this a while I quit and that was the first AI consumer app and I've been watching this space ever since yeah that's amazing I mean when you say launched on your show like what does that mean the the three founders of Siri came to my house twice to launch their product uh first time I found a whole bunch of bugs haha in fact I've seen the back end of Siri I'm one of the few people outside of who works there who's seen the how it works in the back end okay oh that's awesome yeah it'll be okay so fit around yeah he done a few things yeah cause I had a famous blog in Silicon Valley for a decade right um right the only place to talk about startups for a long time right I yeah there was no Tech Crunch when I started blogging right that's crazy yeah and cloud era was the 79th user of Instagram long history but we're here to talk about AI no it's everything is LED up to it so yeah x.com all in the AI space on put them all in the list so if you go to my profile it is I'm the only human who's mapped out the whole AI space on x.com both in companies and people yeah we'll definitely include that ha ha so I could follow as many as I want ha ha ha ha thousand ha ha um so Robert tell us about you know your where you at now with the AI space what are you doing well I'm I'm interviewing a bunch of entrepreneurs on my show unaligned I've done about 30 so far and I have another five to run next week um and then I'm watching the whole world on hmm hmm um I use X Pro and each of those lists is a column and it just refreshes continually and so yeah I'm just tryna find out where the future is going and try to help it along haha help it get here faster haha we have the same goal that's what we're here for haha yeah yeah yeah it's a wild I haven't even uh let's see if I have the chatty PT canvas yet I haven't seen it shut off yet have you have you had a chance to use it Robert yeah it's like if you're busy for a few days seriously hahaha yep yeah it's it's crazy Robert are there any specific obviously you're keeping tabs on we'll call it the big AI data you're just watching everything are there any trends that you're seeing right now that are interesting gonna see their humanoid robot I'm I'm hot and bothered in fact this is the uh oh nice and I I'm hot and bothered by that and then I'm hot and bothered by augmented reality glasses um which will see a a few released in about and in the next year I've I've already seen the the the glasses the the lenses set display week hmm hmm and Boe and a few other companies are making little tiny projectors that are about a quarter the size of a sugar cube that'll fit on the edge of a glasses and shove light into a wave guide that uh gives you an image in so any set of glasses could be adapted no haha the wave guides are two pieces of glass with a Palmer in between with a bunch of billion mirrors and projector shoves light through the optic into your eye it's pretty high interesting technology yeah in about 12 months and then we we've seen uh Meta's Orion glasses which is actually a holographic display yeah deeper image than the waveguides hmm somewhere around there cause right now they cost $10,000 to make the the glasses and they don't have enough compute to drive them and battery and all that so yeah got it yeah once we get the glasses we start moving from we really start moving from a 2D world cause I'm talking to you on a 2D screen yeah and that I have a Vision Pro and Apple Vision Pro and it already does that if you go to the Apple Store and put it on you see the Apple Store all around you you're not seeing the Apple Store hmm yeah ha ha which end of the next year or into 2026 you're gonna see a new Vision Pro hmm is it so I call them I call it the holodeck but yeah be fun and sexy instead of calling it a digital twin world haha um I'd I'd be yeah hmm it's yesterday I saw a startup that's uh uh their AI agents uh go and look for customer feedback on the web right IE trends or marketing data oh there's a we should add a feature it decides to add the feature codes the feature and then checks it in and um uh does quality control runs a whole bunch of tests on it and then if it passes all the tests it checks in and uh oh my haha it's like oh this is bringing us a new world right yeah that's what I've been trying to preach to everybody I I know for the last two years that just like go try these tools out now because it's a taste of the future and it's it's gonna get real weird um you know five years down the road yeah it's it's incredible um I'd be curious are there any other yeah sorry oh yeah no no no worries um I'd be curious are there any other trends in uh AI wearables at all that you're seeing that seem to have legs at all uh cause I've kind of checked out of that space um but you seem more plugged in than I do I have an aura ring right yeah more accurate uh faster smaller right wow uh huh and you start thinking about what I've been talking to medical device yeah including series co founder dad Kitlaus he has a company called Riva Health where you put your finger on a smartphone camera like that and it tells you your blood pressure right wow haha the Apple Watches of the future to see that see that kind of health data going through um and certainly the glasses are gonna be watching a variety of things I don't know if you knew but there's 13 diseases on the back of your eye that can express themselves on the back of their eye so if you have an eye sensor looking at the back of your eye you can see that kind of stuff hmm yeah oh yeah I'm so excited about the medical field I think there's so much yeah yeah you know like like this next mind device has a bunch of sensors and it sits on the back of your head like this and it can sort of tell what you're looking at hahaha and it's still too dorky to be a consumer product but that shows you what a lot of people are trying yeah and what may be coming down the line it's getting wild out there yeah mm hmm wow you can just think about shooting a gun and shoots the gun right haha bit electricity down your nerves just a little twitch boom wow yeah so I mean maybe on the flip side of this all these things are so many exciting changes coming is there anything that you're maybe nervous about or scared for haha I sat next to an AI safety researcher coming back from London what I don't know almost 18 months ago now and he explained to me that the existential risk that AI could could bring someday you know I'm like how does that work he's like well AI's already being beating doctors at seeing tumors and scans so take that you know 100 1,000 more steps maybe someday it decides it doesn't need us cause it's we're no good ha ha ha right hmm we'll see I that that's that's a ways off but you know that that's a big threat I think jobs are the bigger one uh hmm yeah just just start with number one job in America is truck drivers hmm hmm oh wow those jobs are gone in 20 years right yeah yeah these are the the questions that I'm if you haven't noticed for sure you know you can say well yeah I mean the company yesterday has writing yeah uh huh I've been hearing really good things about Devin so yeah yeah just recently I I read a there was a paper that came out that found that GPT4 alone was better than either humans or humans with GPT4 at I don't remember the exact diagnosis tax uh excuse me task right now um but it was some medical diagnosis and and that honestly shocked me um you know I suspect that there's probably when you dig into it you know some problems with methodology from like a medical standpoint but it is I do believe it enough that like it's to believe that we're headed to a a weirder world um a better one in my opinion uh but certainly much weirder and there's we shouldn't have to do you know boring jobs I mean hmm hmm yeah just standing there shoving a board into a haha right a lot of people have to do that kind of job to put food on the table and that's that's the real problem is how do you you know take care of those people get them retrained for something that's relevant you know a job that's relevant right just the nature is going to change significantly you know and and if you don't have tech if you don't know how to build AI or a humanoid robot okay that's that's a tough one right cause it is it yeah it'll be interesting we're split in the country oh yeah okay how do we really get ahead of this thing and uh set up some some policies to really help people get retrain and take care take care putting food on the table for a few years while they do that right uh huh and because have there been any pieces of regulation or legislation that you've seen that has been interesting on that front or has it been pretty dry ah ah ah ah ah with people particularly people who think socialism is horrible right you know haha on that side of the political spectrum uh it's a really hard thing to sell to Americans and oh my God this this the problem we always fight the last war hmm hmm the political will of the country will change based on you know what's going on but right now the jobs report just came out this morning haha jobs are doing really well right now in the country yeah cycle but it it's gonna come up because you you saw it I bet you you have call center jobs are going away because they I can do a call yeah you you you next week at Tesla saying I'm expecting to see a Optimus robot making a McDonald's hamburger and handing it to us right that that's a signal that there's a lot of jobs that are gonna be rather tiled and and done away with and we don't we just don't have a good conversation about that um this is you're no longer on a line making and that's where it's interesting will humans be involved in making the Optimus robot stop it making the Optimus robots and then you know what I mean like it haha California has a grid of 3D printers that prints their robot and you could see a world where uh one of those early robots takes the parts off of the 3D print out of the 3D printer and assemble some right why would you have humans haha uh huh couple years five years away from that you think it's that soon I think it's gonna come sooner than people are expecting we're gonna have a pretty good idea of how fast these things are learning at next week at Tesla and we've seen other robots you know uh huh it looks dorky right now and and rough but you know how AI works is it you know it'll be 20% better next year than this year than 20% better again which accelerates right so you start saying well how many years does it need to get really amazing where he's throwing a football with you in the street yeah yeah I have robo John Alway before the end of the century yeah I a lot of changes coming you know and uh yeah but back to AI you know what what concerns me about AI and I you see uh people are still having trouble figuring it all out you know how to deal with hallucinations how to convince people out of company to use it right mm hmm yeah the human trust but also humans don't like change uh huh listen Com all in AI that's a huge amount of change for people to swallow even for me I can't use all that hmm hmm I have the same 24 hours everybody else has yes sir yeah a lot of people are working on an AI that you talk to uh huh and we're seeing a lot of things come along they're like oh really it can oh it can pick a screen capture it can look at the screen it can figure it out like a human being can oh me yeah yeah okay haha well I guess on this vein I do you have some tools that you use regularly that you really like that I still stuck on chat GPT yeah but chat G P t is still the one that sticks with me particularly because of the new voice features nothing it's crazy yeah cause the Whisper API is so good right yeah my friends who code say that they use like Github uh huh busy uh or or Claude that my friend Dylan likes using Claude for coding um you know so everybody will have their little favorite and and you have to switch them every month cause every month they change yeah yeah ha ha haha exactly or there's so much change in this industry right now I'd be curious you've been you've been in the podcasting game for a long time and just kind of like the social media tech world for a while how do you think AI is going to affect the way that we consume and create content do you think that do you think that social media has a future it's already doing that I I don't care about doing long boring videos anymore cause hey you you can stick your hour long video into Gemini and have it write a transcript and then play with the transcript and talk to the transcript right or talk to all of my videos right yeah to go through 30 videos is it you know what haha yeah and so yeah uh that's real powerful and I I did it myself with Lex Friedman haha I'll stick it in the AI in two minutes I had a transcript out of an 8 8 hour video and then I was talking to the transcript and it would give me the top five points right haha what's the most interesting AI topic that these two talked about something like that right mm hmm yeah yeah that's where we've talked about this a lot on here it's just yeah you stick in a paper there and then it'll build you a podcast just build it for you yeah it's nuts I mean AI's ability to make information accessible is incredible you know all of a sudden a human being can access exponentially more because you're able to tailor the information you don't have to go slog through all of this other stuff you let the AI do that and you pull out the gems you need it's it's amazing talk with her patients in therapy sessions hmm hmm and it writes seven highly detailed scientific notes from your therapy session and uh then it does that for every session so if I have 20 sessions with her it can notice trends over time okay cause she'll comment on nice T-shirt today right good night and that helps the system and her track her patients over time to see it are are they hmm she says it's gonna be malpractice soon not to use AI in therapy because it uh can listen to to uh the conversation in a way that she just can't um and it lets her focus on her patients in a much better way she says but it caught one of these patients uh he he mentioned psoriasis in one of his therapy sessions which is a skin skin disease that's a marker for depression and so it caught some some mental health thing that she just missed because she's you know she didn't hear it or didn't focus on it or didn't recognize it was a thing that keeps coming up with this patient right and the AI can go through 20 weeks of therapy with this patient and and see patterns that a human just it it's hard for a human to see as fascinating cause it's it's that's actually been one of the most surprising things to me about uh AI is how effective current LLMs are already at providing therapy um cause if you had told me that when I first started using chat to be tea like I would have was like yeah sure like you know I'm sure that it's good for just like chatting to here and there but there's been not only anecdotal stories like that but I've read a couple uh I think they've just been like archive preprints or whatever but you know I've read a couple studies that seem fairly legitimate uh regarding using language models in a in a in therapy and they're very very promising so far only listens and really doesn't provide therapy yeah cause she has to take notes on her patients right she used to have to hand write those and she told me that means I'm not paying attention to you haha and be scientific about it right so that she can see these patterns over time um yeah but you're right this is gonna really change mental health because most people don't have the ability to go and see a therapist in the world right right yeah they might not be able to get to one they might live in the middle of nowhere right they the the the mental health uh mm hmm and so this will help a lot of people at least figure out what the hell is going on in hello right and we all could use more of that yeah definitely um a slot machine in Las Vegas it'll tell you how your brain works hahaha when the slot machine is running right and I was like haha yeah yeah elements so I I know Spencer you you kind of ask a similar question but with specifically art we've had a couple AI artists come on and obviously they feel very passionate about AI art I have a sister who is a you know a fine artist as oil painting things like this and she's on the fence she's trying to decide do I like AI or do I not do you have any is is art as we know it kind of gonna be gone is AI just gonna take it over I mean I've been in art museums all over the world um no I mean I uh we can't duplicate uh like an oil painting is a good example in fact on my phone I have a good uh video of an oil painting in Sun Valley Idaho uh huh the stuff doesn't take away from the analog from the real world stuff it adds on to it and is it uh huh I have a list of thirty two hundred AI artists on x.com that I follow and they're doing amazing things from movies to pictures and music all sorts of things are happening um commercial viability is still a little rough because uh you can't uh copyright AI art is it right right so that that's unclear I've been excited about it because I I know where we're heading and that's a holodeck and someday soon you're gonna be talking to a a a a holodeck a a bunch of volumetric pixels around you a Gaussian splat if you wanna be and the AI is gonna generate things I just saw a crude demo that said Cap Gemini where they built a room hmm you're in the Taj Mahal you're in front of the Taj Mahal all the way around you right and it generated that right from all the pictures that it has to choose from and and that'll get better and better and faster and faster I'm seeing so many AI research papers about gassing splats and segmentation of objects right oh man there's so much coming it's the airs who are gonna be really skilled at building those right there's I have some friends who are airs who are who've done 300,000 prompts already so they understand deeply how to talk to this engine uh huh listen yeah and that's what's interesting is yeah people think oh anyone anyone can do AI art let me watch type something in and and get something and talking to yeah it's different no no no yeah come in come in and watch I we share the best of the best sorry uh huh you don't have a huge vocabulary to talk about what they engine right if you don't know who Picasso is how do you ask it to give you something like Picasso right right red or what a technique is right how do you ask it to give you that kind of technique in photography if you don't know f stops and shutter speeds and film types and camera types you're not gonna get as as good image out of it this art is that it's difficult for people to still key it's extremely difficult for people to key in on the nuances cause to them it's digital art it's it's digital but it's like it's like let's look a little closer here and actually think about what it took to get it to look slightly different you know it's I think it'll be interesting to see the first AI art critic and and what they look at and how they evaluate you know festivals for AI movie festivals because there's a good group of people who are creating movie yeah that's cool uh huh it's you know I I I talked for the Ansel Adams son and he gave me a tour around Yosemite Ansel Adams a famous photographer uh huh this is Anselheim started his career as a pianist who whose dad took him to Yosemite with a little Kodak box camera and he just couldn't get this the the emotional content that he felt by being in Yosemite and he dedicated his life to he developed a new kind of he called his own system where he was trying to get more um dynamic range in his black and white photos to show things in the darks and in the brights right is it but he was an innovator that tried to bring us a better photographic representation of Yosemite well now I can take a a camera and and capture the whole valley in a whole way that he could never do right and then I can start messing with that and remixing it hmm ha ha messing with it in a way that he could never do right and and so it's an exciting time I I get I get that people are angsty about you know oh oh my I'm not work as my work doesn't have as much value if this goes on yeah if if somebody who's a real artist gets into AI art yeah looking at your paintings right and so if you can make that you know do something because the camera sees your painting goes oh this is Jane Smith's painting right oh let's let's augment that make a whole world around it right now sudden does the old art have value yeah and does the new art have value uh huh for modern art museum right yeah that's the end world uh so I'd be curious it sounds like you probably think the answer to this is yes um but do you think AGI or ASI either both or or 1 um do you think that those are attainable yeah uh haha some people say it's already here haha haha it knows every freaking thing in the Smithsonian I went through the Smithsonian this summer taking pictures of all sorts tractors and all sorts of shit that you see in the museum there it knew everything I don't know a single human being even those who work in the museum haha right so is that leading us to a world where digital intelligence is gonna be better than us I think it does you know when does everybody decide is way fucking better than a human being haha two years five years today right yeah yeah haha they they spilled some coffee on a table and then they told the robot to clean it up if you have a AGI the robot's gonna recognize it needs to clean up a mess on its own right okay you don't need to be told to clean up a mess if you see a mess right hmm hmm but you can see a path for that yeah so that it can figure out yeah I be curious your definite cause I'm starting to realize that people different people kind of have different things in mind when they talk about AGI can you give us your like what is agit what does that mean what does that look like I mean the the best one is can it create on its own yeah an AI is closed I mean we're using it to discover new drugs hmm hmm and stuff like that um and so in a way it's sort of already there but it but it's not right if you use a chat GPT it still has you have to prompt it right uh huh that real important in the robot world right and and certainly like Tesla next week's gonna announce their robo taxi which is transportation as a service well do those cards figure out where they need to go on their own hmm but soon they're gonna start doing their own thing like oh right maybe we should move a whole bunch of cars toward the music festival so that we'll be ready to pick up people coming out of the music festival yeah and you can see a path to that um I have a feeling it's gonna fool us way before it technically is right yeah uh huh all knowingness is gonna fool a lot of normal people and going man this is oh ha ha haha this this is like better than a human in a lot of ways right and and in some ways it already is better than a human being in a ways right mean you've already had lawyers get in trouble for citing chat GPT outputs that uh cite imaginary cases which is you know hilarious to me that they didn't double check that and also a sign of things to come there's gonna be so many people who think that you know all of the sovereign citizen type type dudes who you know go to court for a speeding ticket and then end up in jail for uh contempt of court like that's gonna happen a lot faster now haha yeah hahaha seriously haha yeah yeah while I'm driving around so now they claim they don't take the interior camera and do anything with it it's somewhere haha it's a new world we're heading into it plus we're gonna be wearing glasses soon with cameras I mean you might have a pair of Ray Bans from Meta Corporation that have a camera yeah a few more steps to where it's able to really process that quickly and do it with video and how many years are we away from that yeah yeah it'll Robert what do you think about everything going on with Neuralink do you think like glasses yeah I mean this is oh no so they don't have to put mm hmm but putting wires on your brain lets you hook directly up to the brain and get a much better resolution so it'll do shit and stuff like that device does but far I know it's kind of boggles my mind first of all and it it potentially takes away the illusion of free will because we really don't have true free will today you can't do whatever you want you can't shoot him in the head and you know continue your life like nothing happened um so there's uh yeah we we talked about that a lot on uh on uh Dylan's Dylan's uh researcher at Unity Labs what's that you know every couple nights uh talking about consciousness and uh uh huh oh my God can control you right I I saw a surgery where the patient was cut open and his head was cut open and he was awake and the and the surgeon was probing his brain and touching it and at one point he touched it and his hand and the patient involuntarily raised his hand up took the thing out of his brain and went down put it back in you know so you're a little puffet if somebody has wires on your brain you uh huh and so that leaves us with a whole bunch of new uh problems that I think we're gonna need regulation to control yeah gonna have to have a lot of trust in the company that yeah if you have a spinal injury you don't care about any of this argument rank you know playing games like the first guy who got the yeah tells about and so there's a lot of good that this is gonna bring yeah where is the line yeah what happens if this company goes bankrupt and you have a bunch of wires in your head and then they stop working or don't get updates anymore there's a whole bunch of problems there so yeah it's it's a it's a scary technology but a one that really empowers human beings hmm how do you wanna talk to your AI with your mouth and just your brain yeah and then can you think to another human that's where I'm like you know what I mean like cause it's telepathy is not that far away you know it's gonna be a fat cast in 3 years yeah I thought cast if if you really had a a lot of wires hooked up to your brain it can tell what your thinking process is and now do you remove the humans ability to have a deliberation with this themselves you know about anything about sexuality or whether you're gonna do something nasty to somebody else right cause you have to have that ability to have that internal dialect with yourself then you take action and you decide who you are and here the wires could be listening to you having that just internal conversation and get involved and that leads to a whole another Pandora's box right that's interesting to talk about right now but I don't know it it's a little ways away cause the surgery cost ha ha rape rape haha and the science is not close to being a consumer product yeah yeah it is a product for a guy with a spinal injury or something like that uh cause it improves his life but it sure does open up a lot of mm hmm but it also gives us a lot of new powers yeah yeah yeah and that's what AI really does yeah uh huh I'd be curious um so from your perspective what do you think uh AI developers users enthusiasts can do to better communicate to those who are not enthusiast about AI is there been anybody who uh has kinda been a good example I tell him it reads the Bible to you right haha well you can take a picture of any any book it it it it uh I use this with the little machine learning book I have it has a lot of math in it that I don't understand so I take picture of the page and then ask Chat TPT can you help me here I'm that's awesome yeah if it can do that with a machine learning book it can do that with the Bible too and tell me tell me more about this passage in the Bible right and now you're talking with regular everyday people uh about their world and how it might affect them and help them uh do what they're doing thank you they I've noticed this over and over in my career every time there's a paradigm shift everybody resists a million people protested the Facebook newsfeed when it turned on right hahaha yeah threads has newsfeeds right yeah 1 million people protested right when it first turned on cause it's new it represents change and you know and people are up in arms and the same things gonna be true here there is a ton of resistance for AI a lot of disdain for it a lot of fear of it mostly surrounding jobs but there are some other fears thank you uh huh technology always brings a benefit at and a bunch of new problems right ha ha cause the technology brought us a good along with some new bad right yeah I I like what you're saying so make it make it relatable and applicable to their life and I think we can have that conversation with anybody but it getting them to change and getting them to go from I hate this saying to using it and being happy with it that that's gonna take a while hmm hmm people eventually will get oh yeah and saving you an hour a day you know oh right right and driving you around and making transportation cheaper and more useful oh that's useful right and by the way Google knows this Google knows that uh the the the auto industry asked me to do some a bunch of customer research researching going around America and asking a question like are you ready to get in a car without a steering wheel ha ha I'm a narcissistic control freaky told me and there's no fucking way a computer's driving me around hahaha yeah to know that if that guy got 3 days of rides in a way Mo he would switch his mind or her mind and and say yeah I can use my phone while the car drives me around right it's certainly in a way mode you can um hey the second question I ask is are you willing to get in a car that drives to you but then gives you a choice and everybody said yes cause even the narcissistic control freak like that lets me be in control and I'm happy uh huh hmm hmm ha ha and we'll soon have full autonomy I you know whether it's next year or the year after or the year after that it's coming and it's coming pretty quick in human history so um yeah humans are fun to study aren't they they really are yeah Robert do you think you actually switch as a consumer because you learn to trust a computer with your life hmm in a car you're gonna trust it with everything you're gonna trust your business with the AI you're gonna trust your life your your health AI right I don't know so that's our goal is to get them over that bump yeah get them to use chat GPT um and you know yeah yeah and just until it's tangible people it's this existential threat but but once it's a tangible oh I can just it's it's feels like a search engine kind I can just type in to chat GPT I can take a picture I can do these things once it's tangible I feel like it's no longer this alien it's just a technology you know yeah and yeah cultural change is really hard inside I'm talking to a lot of companies who are trying to get corporations to change mm hmm and stuff like that it's a tough one you know but they're all they're all having to face it cause you're gonna be out of business if you don't use it soon right yeah building cars now and you know yeah we can keep them out of America for a while and protect auto industry here that doesn't do that ramp Elon Musk is gonna learn how to do that and he has a factory here in America right hmm hmm and or being competitive you're gonna go away and I've seen company after company resist technology changes and they go away right haha they had it they knew what was coming well they didn't really but ha ha haha I got kicked out of their booth in 1989 for knowing more about their digital color printers than they did right ha ha oh my gosh cause it was right at the beginning of that and they were run by chemical engineers that's who ran Kodak and now they're gone that was the big that was a big dramatic company in America is gone yeah yeah Xerox Park has Xerox had the whole industry in one building in Silicon Valley haha their executives thought it was gonna the new desktop public printing that uh those guys invented was gonna put their coffee or business out of work I like that uh keep going I don't know convincing people to change is really hard you saw the dock worker guy right you know who ran the dock worker or runs the dock worker he's like I am not for any automation right hmm cause they're gonna pay me right and I want more of that and I don't want you know automation I won and their ports are way more efficient than ours are right so how how is this gonna work out for you long term at some point we're gonna force them to change hmm you become irrelevant yeah what so how do you convince that guy to change yeah that'll be you know what are you gonna tell him about automation and get him to start you know saying oh yeah right it's a it'll it'll be really tough um in this in a similar vein here just do you think these like I said earlier we've talked to all these small business these founders these AI founders building these from the ground up trying to build these companies you know or do you think they're all gonna be eaten by open AI Apple Amazon Jeremiah Ohyang at his AI event in San Francisco last week said there's only gonna be one app eventually that you're just gonna talk to one thing interact with one thing and it's gonna do everything so the web he sees that is gonna eat the web and you see it right you can when you when you start talking that chat GPT about you know what's the hours on my supercuts it goes out and looks at 3 different websites and then brings the answer back to you right yeah definitely or an AI front end that'll do that and I can see that having a big effect a big roll up effect on the web and on everything else um the main AI is not gonna do everything um so it's gonna still need to call but like there's a new spreadsheet tool that I just interviewed in paradigm right and her spreadsheet's cool cause if you have a list of customer names or list of customer addresses you can start up the third column and prompt to the column and say I want all the social media addresses for these people yeah let's say you have 1,000 names it starts up 1,000 agents goes out that goes out to the internet start bringing all that stuff back into your spreadsheet well is is chat GPT gonna have a spreadsheet interface like that probably not so if it needs a spreadsheet interface it will probably know about paradigm right mm hmm here's your spreadsheet interface um and you know who gets paid in that business oh that's an interesting one right but paradigm has a twenty dollar a month fee right so maybe if you approve it it'll pay paradigm the 20 bucks to do to do the new spreadsheet so I don't know that it I don't think it all goes away but certainly the use the usage changes dramatically cause we're gonna be talking with one AI in our glasses that's gonna fire up a whole bunch of other things behind the scenes hmm but you can see there's disruption coming for the top level thing are we using an Uber app in 10 years what is this it's probably hidden on your phone and you never touch it anymore haha can you make that happen and it makes it happen right and then all of a sudden ride showing up and it tells you that and maybe even brings pieces of the user interface into the main chat or interface that you're talking with right uh does that help Uber not really it takes away some of their brand and some of their uh you know their touch points and now we have a a relationship with like chat GPT so yeah it's it's a problem that it's always been a problem though I you know I've worked at Visual Studio Visual Basic Programmers Journal which is uh uh the hot programming tool in the 1990s for building Windows apps right and they had a toolbar where you could add on all sorts of components like a spreadsheet component or what a charting component or whatever and all of those guys who made those little components they called it riding elephant they knew that Microsoft would copy them or license them or crush them some point and they often did you know micro help that yes and then two years later Visual Studio puts the spreadsheet component into Visual Studio and really does away with the company or does away with that part of their company hmm hmm we are we have to innovate and bring out new controls every year because we know oh my God yeah that the elephant would step on you haha and that's why they call it right now fans like how do you stay on top of this outfit I'll buck you off and then step on you once in a while hmm hmm you know apple and Google and Chat GPT if they see a cool idea like a new spreadsheet that's really cool they're gonna start trying to figure out how to use that or integrate that into the main the main interface so yeah there will be a lot of that effect you know uh huh very focused on a very specific kind of person your customers like you know a spreadsheet person yeah that you can innovate far faster than the big company can hmm hmm well well it's not gonna do a spreadsheet well it's at least for a while right so there's still plenty of room for most of these companies I I mean go through my holiday clusters 700 companies in there and there's all sorts of ha ha yeah so um yeah it it is what it is you know yeah and it will change and you have to stay ahead and some will go away and some will do real well yep yelping interesting to see what happens yeah so Robert as so as we're wrapping up here um if our audience wants to follow you or follow any of your your podcast etc what would be the best place to do that for me X is the best way to be best place to be an AI haha but I I can't follow 25,000 people anywhere else and and share that with you right uh you know on LinkedIn you can have 30,000 connections total and then you're done and you can't put those people into lists so that I can watch like what are all the AI CEOs doing versus the tech journalists hmm hmm right or computer vision I have lists of all these people right and so I can see what the computer vision people are doing yeah that's really cool and I just can't do that anywhere else and you know and so I'm able to watch a lot of a lot of information and share it back out in a way that I just couldn't do on yeah hmm awesome alright come and look at my profile scobalizer and uh go check out the lists uh you can go view lists on the profile and you'll find the entire AI industry there awesome I have a great list of crypto haha everything cause I keep them all off today because they I shows me new people right mm hmm it'll probably show it to me and I'll put you in a list right so and I'm doing that all day long in in two months in the last two months I've added another 5,000 people so it's a constant process of um be it being able to see the whole world yeah um before we wrap up Robert or Spencer is there anything you wanted to talk about or touch on that we haven't gone to haha we'll have to do another one I mean I'm not a programmer so I can't tell you how to how to make your agents run better haha yeah now that you know that there's just a lot hitting people um uh huh you know I'm I'm seeing AR glasses coming that are really pretty interesting yeah snap already was snapping Facebook are showing off sort of prototypes or developer previews stuff like that but they're not for consumers yet they're not down in in a price point that that average everyday people can pay for them and they're not uh fully developed yet so you just look at the next 24 months or you know or so and you you see a lot of change coming for things and and then you see the whole AI industry and they're building crazy things yeah hmm hmm I'm about to put up two videos from two separate companies that are doing email AI assist yeah answer your emails and look at your past emails to try to figure out what your how you word things to the specific person right it's like whoa there's a lot coming and a lot of change ahead cause if you're not using an AI tool for for answering your email you soon will be right uh huh that alone takes a little bit of time to learn how to how to work with it and to trust it right and and to and to work with it then and force yourself to work with it I call this AI first thinking are you forcing yourself to use AI for every fucking thing you can obviously I'm not using it on this call but I should be right I should be talking in my ear like oh hahaha yeah right right exactly awesome well Robert thank you so much for coming on I miss you and keeping tabs on the whole industry thanks for updating those lists we'll make sure to get that disseminated to everybody Irina and I are rewriting our spatial computing book that should be out hopefully later this year great I wrote 2 books on spatial computing before apple ship well now apple ships needs a rewrite yeah ha ha excellent perfect well thank you so much and yeah it's crazy stuff I just I interviewed them on stage last year